How low can the scammers go?

Disinformation report

How low can the scammers go?

Can he pull off the trick?

In the previous Signpost issue this column described Elite Wiki Writers, a company that scams their clients who only wish to have an article about themselves posted on Wikipedia. A transcript of an actual online sales pitch showed that their supposed Wikipedia paid editors were totally ignorant of Wikipedia rules. But are there other companies running similar scams? Could their representatives be even more ignorant of our rules?

A long-time Wikipedia editor and former board member of the Wikimedia Foundation, Doc James, ran into a possible case of such a company at about the same time as he read the previous article. There is currently an article about him on Wikipedia. While the prices and some of the methods appear quite different than those of Elite Wiki Writers, the general scam looks similar.

Dr. J, as we will call him for short, was approached on LinkedIn, by a person we'll call GoLI. Besides changing the participants' names in the following transcript of his interaction on LinkedIn, we've deleted several other details in order to comply with Wikipedia's rules on outing and reformatted the transcript text to better fit this space. Spelling and grammar have been left as originally posted.

FEB 1
GoLI • 6:46 PM
Hi Dr. J.!
This is GoLI. I wanted to reach out, because I found out there is no wikipedia article about you. I've been a wikipedia Editor from last 3 years, l've edited and created, contributed many articles on wikipedia.
Having a dedicated wikipedia article about you is great for personal Branding.
I can create a wikipedia article about You, If that something excites you just - - - reply me here.
Here's my wikipedia profile:) [Link to Wikipedia user page removed] Looking forward to work with you...

I am Google Knowledge Panel / Knowledge Graph creator. I have 4000+ Google Panel make experience.
If you are Public Figure, Entrepreneur, Business Owner, Author, Artist, Photographer, Influencer, Model, Actor, Racer, Fashion Designer, Director, Producer, Doctor, Lawyer, Marketer, Fitness guru, Personal Trainer, Chef etc and You want your Digital Visibility, Google ranking, Social Media Verification, Market Placement, Boost SEO etc then This Knowledge panel service 100% perfect for you.
So why you will miss this google panel service?
No more waiting. Buy with Confidence, without any confusion.
If have any question about knowledge panel / knowledge graph, Don't forget for ask me.

I am waiting for your action.

Thanks for your time.
MONDAY
Dr. J. • 5:33 PM
So you offer this as a paid service?
GoLI • 6:33 PM
Yes
I'II charge 100$ for wiki page creation and 150$ for Google knowledge Panal
Dr. J. • 8:35 PM
Do you do lanquages other than English?
GoLI • 8:36 PM
Yes, I do
Dr. J. • 8:47 PM
But don't you require lots of references about the person?
GoLI • 8:47 PM
We need 3 4 References
GoLI • 10:09 PM
You have to create both Wikipedia and Google
Knowledge Panel right?
TUESDAY
Dr. J. • 5:32 PM
Sure, does one pay before or after completion?
GoLI • 5:36 PM
You need both wiki and knowledge panel?
GoLI • 5:40 PM
Don't worry, an invoice will be sent to you, after payment your wiki page and knowledge panel will be ready within a few days, I will share the link with you.
Dr. J. • 5:40 PM
Thanks
Both
GoLI • 5:42 PM
Great send me the information in email

Wikipedia Article Information

Your Photo for wiki

Full Name

Born

Citizenship

Alma mater

Occupation

Website

Organization

Awards

Short Introduction about you (Imdb intro will work)

Earl Life and education

Career

Personal Life

Awards and honours/Achievements

You have to follow above template and provide me with the info.

Google Knowledge Panal Requirements:

Name, Occupation, Birthday, Birthplace, Social media

Links and If you want send me your educational institution name.

Send me details here:- [email address removed]

GoLI • 5:59 PM
As soon as I get the info I'll start working on your wiki page and google Knowledge graph
WEDNESDAY
GoLI • 6:10 PM
Any update?
Dr. J. 6:20 PM
Ah so, I need to write the content in question? And then you just get it approved for publication?
GoLI • 6:40 PM
You just send me these details in short form, then I will write your content and submit it for approval.
GoLI • 6:40 PM
You just send me these details in short form, then I will write your content and submit it for approval.
THURSDAY
Dr. J. • 10:27 PM
Okay. By the way do you need to indicate it was me who paid you when you post the article?
GoLI • 10:29 PM
Nope
Dr. J. • 10:29 PM
What about the editor who does the positing? What is their position within Wikipedia? And do they indicate that they are paid? ... sorry does the posting.
GoLI • 10:31 PM
Yes you are right, all wiki editors can submit pages for editing and approval and are paid for that.
Dr. J. • 10:32 PM
Ah cool. Also your Wikipedia account says you started editing in April of 2018 but your linkedin profile says you started editing in Dec of 2020.
GoLI • 10:34 PM
I started editing my wiki from 2018. I have many editing wiki accounts under 'That's why'
Dr. J. • 10:34 PM
Your allowed to use more than one account? I though there was rules against that?
GoLI • 10:36 PM
Nope
I also have my own team, which also includes wiki administrators.
FRIDAY
Dr. J. • 11:01 PM
You have Wikipedia administrators working for you? I did not think that was allowed either?
Is what you are doing above board? Or is this sort of covert work you do?
GoLI • 11:03 PM
We work in a team, we know each other, I have been working as a Wikipedia editor for so many years, that's why
GoLI • 11:04 PM
We work under the same board but are familiar with each other.
Dr. J. • 11:07 PM
The question is, is what you are doing legit? Ie is it permitted?
GoLI • 11:07 PM
Yes, it is
I have written many articles for Wikipedia, including articles about [links to five articles, all related to television shows, removed.]
Dr. J. • 11:09 PM
I asked "And do they indicate that they are paid?" Wikipedia requires this from what I understand.
Your answers are not clear.
Additionally how does one pay your organization? And who exactly are you working for?
GoLI • 11:12 PM
Wikipedia doesn't need it and we work within Wikipedia as Wikipedia editors.
Dr. J. • 11:17 PM I googled and came across this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Paid-contribution_disclosure
Wikipedia:Paid-contribution disclosure - Wikipedia en.wikipedia.org • 5 min read
Dr. J.
GoLI • 11:21 PM
Sir, for creating your wiki page, I will charge a simple amount of $100 and after creating your page, I will submit your page for approval and your page will go live in a few days, simple.
Dr. J. • 11:22 PM
How does one pay?
You take credit cards?
And what is the guarantee for this service?
GoLI • 11:24 PM
I have been editing Wikipedia for five years. I have created many pages, and my credibility has grown over time; so it is very unlikely that a page I create will be deleted. So the process is simple: you provide me with information about you, and I'll make some tweaks if necessary, and your page will be up.
Yes, it is only one time payment, after that if you want to add something on the page, then separate charges will be levied.
Via PayPal?
Dr. J. • 11:25 PM
Okay. What is the paypal address?
Or do you send me an invoice?
GoLI • 11:26 PM
I'll send you invoice
Google knowledge panel also has to be made?
Dr. J. • 11:27 PM
Yes please
GoLI • 11:28 PM
Okay wait I'll send you invoice and also send me wiki details and knowledge Panal details in my email address [email address removed]
Your invoice is ready, send me the details in my email and in a few days your Google Knowledge Panal and wiki page will go live, I will share your link.
[Paypal account details removed]
[Invoice summary $100 for Wikipedia article, $150 for Google Knowledge Panal (sic), $250 total]
Dr. J. • 11:37 PM
Ah... Your profile says you are in [City 1, in North America]. Your name is stated as [name removed]. But the paypal invoice is from [City 2, in Asia]. And the email is [email address removed]
Seriously man what is going on?
GoLI • 11:39 PM
I live in [City 1], my team member has a PayPal profile, so I accept direct bank transfer and [a European bank name removed] payment, here's why
Dr. J. • 11:40 PM
So the company is out of [Asian city] than...
GoLI • 11:40 PM
Don't worry sir, your page and knowledge panel will be ready in 7 days, if not then I will refund you the full payment.
trust me
Dr. J. • 11:42 PM
Apologies need more verification. How do I know the account you listed on Wikipedia is even you? How do I know you dont just take peoples money and disappear?
GoLI • 11:45 PM
Sir, my profile is listed in Wikipedia and I will not work as a doctor on people's money, this is my work. Sir, I have to do genuine work because this is the source of my income.
GoLI • 11:46 PM
If I give you a chance, I will work for you and you will recommend me to others.
GoLI • 11:48 PM
If you are hesitant in paying me PayPal then please do bank transfer to me. I have a US Bank account sir.
If I was not in [City 1], how would I have that bank account?
Dr. J. • 11:57 PM
And what is the bank account info?
GoLI • 11:58 PM
Here are the USD account details for GoLI [detailed banking information removed]
[After further discussion of financial details and GoLI's identity]
SATURDAY
Dr. J • 8:31 PM
Okay so prove this account you claim is yours is in fact you. [Link to user account removed] Edit that page saying "Still editing in 2024"
Dr. J • 8:34 PM
I imagine you cannot as you are just pretending that is your account...

The picture used in the person's LinkedIn profile was not theirs, and the person to whom it belonged reported his impostor to LinkedIn. We'll update this page if GoLI responds on Wikipedia.

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13 February 2024 (all comments)

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@Smallbones: Well, it's safe to say that James definitely did not mince for words while trying to unmask this guy... : D

But seriously, this is a real problem. Likely even worse than we thought. --Oltrepier (talk) 10:40, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I tried Googling (in an incognito window) "Can you pay to get a Wikipedia article about you?" to see what the top search results are:

Wikipedia:An article about yourself isn't necessarily a good thing. OK, that's at least from us. But trying to place myself in the shoes of someone being enticed by a scammer, I've probably already made up my mind, so it's not a very enticing result. And if I do click on it, there's nothing on that page about the scam except a link to the scam warning at the very bottom of the see also section, which I have a very low chance of reaching.
You don’t need to pay for a Wikipedia article, a WMF blog post. Excellent. (Being from 2018, though, it links to Wikipedia:Simple conflict of interest edit request, which is not a user-friendly page compared to the edit request wizard introduced in 2020.)
How Much Does a Wikipedia Page Cost and Why?, a LinkedIn blog post, with the first sentence A Wikipedia page costs £2040, linking to wikinative.com. Curiously, it also links to the WMF blog post — one way to see that is that the "people will believe what they want to believe rather than what has the best evidence" factor is strong enough that the scammer feels confident it won't deter clients.

Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Scam warning appears nowhere in the results. As sleazy of a realm as SEO is, if we want people at risk of the scam to find the warning, then we should probably better optimize our warning so that it has a fighting chance of showing up for the searches they're likely to make. Sdkb ^talk 03:56, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No doubt their product jams up the Afc process, but I can't imagine much gets through, and the pretty low prices may actually spoil the market for better quality COI paid editing, which might even be a good thing. Was it India? Johnbod (talk) 05:10, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Appeared to be India yes. Or at least that was were they wanted the money send. They claimed they went to Harvard like many of these scammers. It was amazing just how lazy they are. My linkedin page clearly says a few times that i edit Wikipedia. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 01:12, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I still believe that a well-thought public outreach by WMF is overdue and would work wonders. Imagine if they used their ill-gotten gains to put a full page ad in big city newspapers telling the public not to pay for articles. Imagine if they told the public via corporate media that Wikipedia as an information service cracks down on abuses. They won't because the WMF needs new furniture. They get paid, the scammers get paid, and everyone but the little people are happy. Chris Troutman (talk) 15:40, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Although you might be right about the office furniture, I suspect a more important reason this will never happen is that the Foundation is unsure which media would reach the largest number of potential victims. (No, advertising in the NY Times would not reach all them, let alone most of the US. But the publicity around such a campaign might.) -- llywrch (talk) 22:32, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Sdkb I was just trying to find that page in specific, and the only way I found it through google was... this comment. So, thanks for helping someone from the future. But also, we really do need to do something about the findability of this page. -- asilvering (talk) 00:37, 11 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Off-topic discussion on a content dispute

I have a feeling the article on Borscht also has this "free thinkers when they meet paid thinkers" problem. There is this user, TaivoLinguist, who keeps reverting edits regarding borscht's origins* "per WP:CONSENSUS", but cannot actually show where the consensus have been reached - pointing to "archives [1], [2], [3]" and saying "it is there". ADDITIONAL INFO: Borscht, as it turns out, have been long before beets were added, but those kind of borscht are now "namesakes". Ugh. 81.89.66.133 (talk) 06:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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